?

Log in

No account? Create an account
entries friends calendar profile Previous Previous Next Next
neuroscience
charge a few neurons
fleaplus
neuroscience
fleaplus
Ringach ceasing primate research due to threats
64 Experiments | Propose your hypothesis
Comments
From: semiconsciously Date: August 23rd, 2006 01:34 am (UTC) (Link)
TERROR! Terrorists! They're everywhere.
I'd call these folks communists though: ecocommunoterrorfascists.

Sorry. :)

"Terrorist" is just such a loaded term right now. They're not terrorists. They're assholes.
psychelle From: psychelle Date: August 23rd, 2006 03:23 am (UTC) (Link)
I agree that terrorist is a loaded term, all the more reason to show that what these people do is terrorism. The used intimidation to create a state of fear and terror that violated the rights of the researchers being targeted. What they did was terrorism, it's just a shame that because of the political climate using that word becomes trite at best.
From: semiconsciously Date: August 23rd, 2006 04:38 am (UTC) (Link)
I still prefer to just call assholes assholes.
People bombing children in the streets are terrorists. People picketing on your lawn are just assholes.
psychelle From: psychelle Date: August 23rd, 2006 04:41 am (UTC) (Link)
So, what are people trying to bomb your house? Or people threatening your children? Don't get me wrong I think they are assholes, but I also think they are terrorists. I think if you look up the definition you will find that it is completely appropriate to call them terrorists.
From: semiconsciously Date: August 23rd, 2006 04:55 am (UTC) (Link)
The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons. (Dictionary.com)

Meh. I'd argue they're not trying to change society or government, just a few scientists at UCLA, so it's not large-scale enough to be "terrorism"... but definitions are nice and not-precise like that.

My point, more specifically, was to say that the term "terrorism" is now heavily-loaded and an appeal to emotion. Picketing is not terrorism. I doubt they were "frightening his children" by holding guns to their heads. The children were probably scared because there were a lot of yelling folks on their lawn.

By your use of the definition, people in gay pride parades in the streets would be "terrorists", because kids might be afraid, and people make calls to Representatives, and write angry letters. Hell, that would be an even better fit because people are trying to change society.

But yes, I get your point and I don't care enough to keep this tangent going. :)
From: semiconsciously Date: August 23rd, 2006 04:58 am (UTC) (Link)
This is terrorism.

"A man described as the Animal Liberation Front's top bomber is facing jail after admitting he carried out explosive attacks on the homes of a number of people with connections to a pharmaceutical research laboratory."
psychelle From: psychelle Date: August 23rd, 2006 05:04 am (UTC) (Link)
I agree that is terrorism. I notice that you are ignoring this part of the article

"In June, the Animal Liberation Front took credit for trying to put a Molotov cocktail on the doorstep of Lynn Fairbanks, another UCLA researcher who does experimentation on animals. The explosive was accidentally placed on the doorstep of Fairbanks’s elderly neighbor’s house, and did not detonate."

That is what I am referring to as terrorism. Not the picketing. Sorry for the confusion.
From: semiconsciously Date: August 23rd, 2006 05:11 am (UTC) (Link)
"Ignoring" would imply it was willful.
Think of it more as me being "dumb".

I take refuge behind the fact that I'm getting married in four days and my fiancee wants me to pack right now for the honeymoon. I'm distracted. :)
fleaplus From: fleaplus Date: August 23rd, 2006 07:01 am (UTC) (Link)
Congrats on the impending marriage, and best of luck. :)
demon_cock From: demon_cock Date: August 23rd, 2006 10:13 am (UTC) (Link)
Well, while not wanting to continue the thread when it's all been resolved ;)
I wrote terrorists because I don't like them calling themselves "animal rights campaigners". They don't campaign in the traditional "will you sign our petition" way that other groups do. There's loads of problems in the UK with bomb threats and other things.

They've also taken to threatening political figures over their views on certain topics.

Anyway, I'm just falling in line with the view of the FBI ;)
psychelle From: psychelle Date: August 23rd, 2006 11:52 am (UTC) (Link)
Fair enough! Congratulations and good luck. I just got married about 4 months ago, so I know how distracted you must be. Maybe ignoring wasn't the right word. :)
misfratz From: misfratz Date: August 23rd, 2006 09:16 am (UTC) (Link)
WTF? Communism is a specific political/economic idea which has nothing to do with animal testing. I hope you are joking?
demon_cock From: demon_cock Date: August 23rd, 2006 10:14 am (UTC) (Link)
Maybe "communo" as in "they live in a commune". They probably do, damn hippies! :P
demon_cock From: demon_cock Date: August 23rd, 2006 11:00 am (UTC) (Link)
Oh, completely missed the whole ACTUAL word communist there. Think I need more sleep.
From: semiconsciously Date: August 23rd, 2006 04:30 pm (UTC) (Link)
Heh. I'm was just being a smart ass and drawing parallels between the use of the terms "communist", "fascist", and "terrorist" as they've been used politically in the Western World.

As Orwell argued, such words are lazy metaphors intended to draw upon emotional reserves rather than to evoke thought. Those words mean "bad", whereas the words "democracy", "free", "justice", etc. mean "good".

America is not a Democracy, it's a Federal Republic, and it was founded by terrorists.

I'm making a plea for people to think about the terms they're using within a social context. Words mean more than just their definition; they carry and excess emotional context that can be easily manipulated.
64 Experiments | Propose your hypothesis